SLROC Forum

Hello All,

This is something I've been wondering about for a while.

I've got my lovely, basic, 1985 One-Ten, now with a 300Tdi. And my "fancy-new" 1993 Classic Rangie, which in comparison has at least a billion more gadgets, gizmos and computer-related guff than the Landy (to go wrong...)

Looking at even the most basic modern cars & vans, they have many features that make me think 'does it need it?'

My question is, would Land Rover (or any manufacturer) make, for example, a 'New' model, without any extras like engine management, heated windows, ABS, cruise control, parking sensors, sensors to let you know if it's raining, sensors to tell you to put your headlights on, sensors to tell you to stop for a piss... or anything controlled by a computer?
Maybe just a good, well built mechanical vehicle which the driver actually has to drive, which would be a lot cheaper than a more tech'd-up equivalent, Like my old Landy?

Could Land Rover just make a Disco 4, for example, which looks and drives the same, but without the gadgets (and less than around 50 Grand).
I feel sorry for Landy owners of the future, trying to fix problems with modern motors!

Cheers,

Mike

 

Don't start me!

Having recently given up the ownership of a proper Series 3 Land Rover, I often thought that if they had made them brand new at a reasonable price I would have bought one. Never failed an MOT in my ownership. Do the brakes work , does the steering work, do the lights, horn and seat-belts work? If the answer was yes then it passed. Fortunately the chassis was solid on that one! With the latest changes to the MOT test the powers that be have given a license to print money to every dealership if you happen to have a warning light on or off at the wrong time. Unfortunately the emission limits dictate that electronic engine management is a must have otherwise a modern 'proper' Land Rover could be done. I live in hope that Tata with their origins could build a decent 'utility' Defender using the cheap labour available in India but sadly they seem intent on adding more bling and electronics (and £££££s).

There is a lot to be said for a vehicle that you can fix with nothing more than a hammer, screwdriver and a 13mm (or 1/2") A/F spanner. Ask the Army or a Farmer.

Did I mention not to start me? 

This really is a discussion to be had over a pint or two.... 

There are manufacturers out there prepared to offer basic vehicles.
eg
Dacia Duster (Renault) and you might not even get a Radio in the basic package.

george

PS
From Feb 2011 All new EU Type approved cars with DRL's fitted as Standard. (at least not compulsory to use yet.
From 2012 TPMS must be fitted as Standard to all new EU Type approved cars.
Euro 5 Emissions, but where will we be by the time its Euro 6 Emission Standards.
Tyre Noise Regulations & Legislation will limit the tyres fitted to new Cars just in the next couple of years.
Your vehicles 'sound level' is now on the V5 of new cars, so expect to have to meet that sometime in the future at MOT's

Holding onto that good 300tdi will be a very good idea.

Have spent the last three days trying to find the esteemed and venerable a simple four door diesel estate.

What a trial! More knobs, whistle's and unecessary tat than anybody could ever use, and, just more bits to go wrong. Have probably settled on a SAAB as at least the inside did not seem like the star ship enterprise on steroids.

Personally I find my 200 TDI disco over sophisticated and about as new as I would wish to purchase. I think 1990 is about the peak of stuff I need bolted on to my vehicle, any later and the lights come on at random followed by the wipers and the occasional bong, bing, beep or chirupp to tell me it's f*&%^$ing snowing, like I have stopped looking out of the front window!

You may have hit a nerve.

Going back to my cave/shed to forge some new underpants from scrap manhole covers now.

And . . .

What is a DRL? TPMS? Am I missing out? Would my life be better with them?

coop (the luddite)

I do not think you are missing out.

'Daylight Running Lights'.
To let others know you are moving without you switching lights on, they come on with the engine.
(solution if not on the Vehicle is Drive with sidelights on in Daylight, then the Tail Lights will also be on.)
& Use proper lights in Poor Visability not think you have enough on because DRL's are shining Forward.

'Tyre Pressure Monitoring System',
 to tell you a tyre has lost pressure suddenly and many people never bother checking tyre pressures them self or resetting the TPMS.
Really there for Run Flat Tyres.
(solution set your own tyres and feel the steering go funny if a tyre lets go.
Set and check your own tyre pressures regularly)

Another waste of Space, IMO
Wing Mirrors that turn down as you reverse.
But are likely to be frozen solid some winter days.
Something else to break and cost too much to fix.

george

must say i am tempted to look at a dacia duster -how ever i would be wanting the big(1.6 natch)  diesel engine and the 4wd system - the base model doesnt come with either - your then up to 13 grand and forced to take some gadgets and a turbo


 how ever the frontera of doom is holding together just fine and it has the added bonus of being great at the crap car traffic jam barging - everyone stops for dents and rust and it can tow 2.7 tonne (or my landy) 

My van is a classic no electrics or turbos - 06 plate peugeot partner 1.9D . Keep fit windaes and manual locking - been an ace motor. 

Must admit the heated front seats on my defender are a boon in Scotland's subtropical climate

Must admit the heated front seats on my defender are a boon in Scotland's subtropical climate

I preferred a V8 for auxilliary heating (carburetor model of course). 

On electronics here is my rant....

There are 2 types of vehicle users, lets call them type1 and type2

Type1, are like most of the people on here, myself included, that know their vehicle well and understand vehicle sympathy, can "feel" what a vehicle is doing when driven and get some enjoyment in keeping it roadworthy.

Type2, are like my wife, who see a vehicle as a vital means of getting from a to b, they dont drive it they opperate it and couldnt give a dam about it as long as its going, they wouldnt feel a slow puncture untill the tyre started flappin past the drivers window.

My wife changes her car every 3 years, ticks more of the options boxes every time to get more cool stuff and never washes it or hoovers it or checks the oil, water or tyres, all that just happends by itself over the weekend.
I on the other hand drive the biggest bucket in the street and on some of my free time im doing either one of the cars or the other.

My point is, im very happy with the increased levels of electronics in modern cars, it makes them very safe places to be, safe for my wife n kids and safe for the other people using the same bit of road as her, things like Advanced ABS, Traction control, Vehicle stability programs, Airbag modules etc etc will all help to ensure that providing the laws of physics are not broken then your loved ones will come home to you every time. Remember, each one of these systems has been developed because someones loved ones did not return home.

It is a shame that the type2 drivers are in the majority, and by a very large margin, but thats life. As for the type1 drivers of the future, im sure they will adapt to the new vehicles being built, they will swap the mig and the angle grinder for loads of test leads and a new laptop.

Put every type2 in a new bmw, they are fantastic cars but bloo*y useless in the snow, that way they can stay at home when us type1's are out enjoying ourselves.

Before anyone buys a Saab, phone the parts department and ask for the price for 1 injector, you had better sit down first.

Drew.

I must confess that my next daily driver will probably have bluetooth which pleases me. I do enjoy climate control and cruise control. Automatic gearboxes have come on a bit since the Avenger 1500 I drove many years ago

I also enjoy the utility experience of my Defender. The best bit is to drive either for a few days and then drive the other!

Am I type 1 or 2? I would say 1 with 2ish tendencies (the passage of time does not incline me to too much mechanicing, but some can be satisfying) or whilst I wouldn't align myself with Mr A Blair perhaps there is a 3rd way?

You sound like a type 1 to me, is it possible your just maturing well and enjoying the easy life that all the gizmo's give, I lifted the disco by 2 inches, not to improve it off road but so I can squeeeeeze under it.
I would love to fit a 4 post ramp in the drive, it would make checking the tyre pressures so much easier.