SLROC Forum

Anybody come across this before? A friend has just been caught at 61mph towing a trailer on the A9 (single carriageway),if the limit for cars is 60 mph,towing 50 mph,how does a fixed camera identify you as pulling a trailer and so should be at the lower speed? I have followed HGV,s etc through camera,s at nearly 60,never known them to activate the flash and they should be doing 40 mph!

Unless he was spotted on cctv and they set the camera I can't see how it could flash at 60 just for him. A traffic cop from dundee reliably informed me that the cameras were ( this was a while ago now!) to 83mph.

Was it just a single flash? I've seen them give a single flash before at lower speeds almost like a test

He remembers the double flash,the camera is on the Southbound A9 before Killiecrankie,his ticket states he was exceeding the 50 limit while towing a trailer.

Sounds like a manned camera. I was recently booked on a dual carriageway where the limit was 70 but because I was driving a VW Transporter van, the limit for me was 60. I had no idea that a Transit sized van was limited to 10 mph under the national limit. This also applies to single carriageways where the limit is 60, the van is limited to 50. I have hired vans many times and never been informed of this and have never seen a warning displayed in the vans. Apparently this became law in the 80's. I don't think a fixed camera can differentiate between types of vehicles so I assume it was a hidden manned camera.
My first offence in 37 years of driving....gutted!

Sometimes the auto cameras go off due to odd reflections between one part of the vehicle and another.

i went past one at 27mph and a bus going the other way at the same time (doing less than 30.. estimate)
the camera went off for me. Heard nothing though. the camera must have seen the difference in speed between me and the bus, momentarily giving a 60ish speed difference.

(i think for a 30 mph zome the camera is set to about 37-38, so for a 70 zone it would probably be 70+10%+4 or something--- 81mph?)

I believe the photo is (in some cases, perhaps all) studied by a person who then calculates the vehicles speed from the road markings and then checks against what speed the vehicle should be doing. it was bad luck to have odd reflections, and to be towing. if you did the same speed in the vehicle not towing, and the same reflections occured setting off the camera, there would be no ticket.

I have not tried this, but you could probably set off the camera by holding a piece of metal in front of it and moving it away rapidly...

Some fixed site speed camera (and the majority of the ones I've seen) are now fitted with a height sensor facing the oncoming traffic

Once it senses your over a given height it changes the speed limit that it will go off at.

If the trailer, that was being towed, was as tall as a large van then it might of kicked the limit down (trying to do what they did to Stan ), it's then that they look at the pictures, speed, see the trailer and send a ticket out.

I know height sensing is there because I was driving one of our trucks up the A68 and went past a fixed speed camera doing 50mph - it flashed at me twice but with this truck we are allowed to do 50mph on an A road so a ticket never came in the post.

If you want to look out for this the fixed camera with height sensors have a small vertical slot in the back of the camera - you'll see it when you driving towards it

Hope you have fun trying to see which camera are fitted with height sensors and which aren't

some of the cameras have strips in the road that detect the length of vehicle, same type of thing you see in front of traffic lights cut into the tar in a criss cross pattern,
anyways good luck the police on the a9 were on a zero tolerence drive recently, my father was done for 4mph over in his car, tried to appeal and lost, think that was under highlands police not tayside though,

did he bring you a special set of wheels back if he was up the a9 colin?

Its not been unknown for speed cameras to focus on something on the back of a vehicle which is moving quicker than the speed limit, i havent heard of this in a while though,,, things which have been identified as suspected of this have been number plates vibrating, strap ends blowing about, and in my case was the snow being blown off the roof, just about anything thats insecure on the outside,

for a long time this was dismissed by the athourities until they started getting people appealing because there vehicles were just not capable of the speeds accused off, for instance a tractor being accused of 140 mph,, this almost led to the fixed speed camera being banned in germany

there used to be lots off info on this on the internet years ago you may want to search it out, also some fixed speed camera's have sensors in the road also,, for trailers and large vehicles,
another thing to consider if you drive a van,  any van,  your legal speed limit  is reduced like hgv's to 40 mph on A roads if you have no windows in the rear doors, traffic coppers love this one,,
also there's something about what speed double cabs can travel at on the motorway or dual carriagway i'm unable to recal what it is though, but its not the same speed as a car,,

Interesting point on the legal speed limit for vans with no windows in the rear doors.

Ive got a semi-hitop van ( no windows in rear doors ) and ive always known about panel vans been below the national speed limit. Also, some council vans in Fife, WITHOUT windows in the rear doors, basically advertise the speed restrictions on their back doors at being 50mph on single carriageway roads.

I was also informed that small vans that derive from vans i.e transit connect, are also restricted to the lower limits, where vans that derive from cars or small people carriers i.e kangoo are not.....

I'm sure its fifty on a dual carriageway and forty on an a road, according to my employer as a workmate had been booked on the oakley road in one of those berlingo vans,,we were all dragged in for the debrief the type of vans like astra vans or the kangoo were never referd to just took it as all vans, 

Q. Are there any exemptions from these lower speed limits for vans?


A.  There is one (small) group of vans which have the same speed limits are cars by virtue of the definitions in Schedule 6 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act of 1984.  These are vans that are both derived from a car chassis and also have a maximum laden weight of no more than 2 tonnes.  This means that the weight of the vehicle and the payload it is designed to be able to carry when added together do not exceed 2 tonnes.  The van design must be a derivative of a car body, it is not sufficient that it looks similar to a particular car.

This is from DVLA came accross this years ago by way of company flyer. Hope this helps

i was driving down a1 near torness power station and i got flashed never thought anymore about it 4 weeks later got soummond to head office to explain the fixed pently notice i was clocked at 46 mph i was also unaware that camers could tell the difrence cars/lorrys/weight restrictions etc how wrong was i, went to the police to see the photos of it and i ask how they could tell my lorry was not a car etc and was told they couldent explain it to me, i mean 6mph over limit and i got 3 points and ?30 fine and was told because i was hgv driver i should no better   i know drive at the speed limit 40 mph on single carrageways and the traffic behind me is long but the law is the law  

i wouldnt even consider hairing along  with a trailer at 60+

Another case of the law not keeping pace with technology.  Many of these laws were brought in years ago when you were lucky if a van could reach 50mph.  Nobody can argue that it's acceptable to break the law however stupid or outdated it is, but I'm genuinely concerned that the use of some cameras aren't being used to promote safety - if that was the case average speed camera's would appear to be the most effective at lowering speeds over longer distances.

What hacks me off is that sometime in the mid 2000's I had to spend a fortune either retrofitting speed limiters or having ecu's remapped to our fleet of van converted minibuses to make them compliant with the laws brought in at that time  yet 6 years on I still see brand new panel vans flying past me on the motorway, well in excess of the national speed limit.

It seems that it's safe not to limit a 3.5 ton gross van but one rated at 3.6 ton gross does - crazy
 
Duncan

A great example of a money-making speed trap was one that caught me years ago down south. There were two sections of normal 60 mph road running straight as a die through Army training area for almost a mile each, connected by a short strip of 40mph outside the entrance to a closed and deserted camp. Obviously the limit had been imposed when the camp was active and vehicles turning in etc. The entrance to the camp made a great layby for Plod tho, and was a regular location for a manned speed trap - doing nothing for safety but a lot of revenue generation.